he grabbed it. i took it from him. >> an inmate with a reputation for trouble takes on a no nonsense warden. >> i run this jail. i give me the right. >> it's very rare that you see an older person come into a facility. when she first came into my area, she looked like she was a grandmother figure.

>> a 71-year-old woman convicted for an investment scheme that left nearly 800 victims in its wake. >> they, in my eyes, were not victims but they were leonards to me. >> identical twins segregated in separate housing units find they can't live with or without each other. >> it hurts. i'm almost in tears talking about it because we really are very, very close. very close and -- cleveland, ohio, a city that has seen its ups and downs but like all big cities crime is an issue in good times and bad.

if you're arrested in cleveland, you could spend anywhere from a few hours to several years inside the cuyahoga county correction center. most of the 2200 men and women incarcerated here have only been charged with crimes and are weight trial of the resolution of their cases. some say the jail is a city unto itself but its director would disagree. >> i don't think this is a little city. i don't think there's a city like this in the real world. only because we have a large volume of very difficult people. >> everyone else put your hands up on your head. >> people with a lot of troubles and a lot of needs. >> according to correctional staff, inmate charles evans fits that description. >> i'm charles now, but they used to call me allen. >> i've been coming here since 1994. i used to be a big time drug dealer, all this and that. everybody in this building know

who i am. >> evans is currently serving a six-month sentence for theft, but during his stay, he's managed to make matters a whole lot worse. >> this is all his disciplinary isolation that we've gone through. not even been here a year yet. >> been involved in 13 altercations that landed him in segregation for more than 90 days. >> charles evans is very unpredictable. he's disruptive. he's in lockup, he's out of lockup. you're dealing with him constant. one day he's acting out, the next day he's apologizing, then he's acting out again. so he's up and down. >> put chains on a man and do what you want to do with him, when the chains come off, a man is going to react. that's like backing a cat in a corner. >> two months earlier during a fight with another inmate, evans put one of the jail's special response team members on the sidelines. >> inmate evans was on top of another inmate during an altercation with a brook stick

around his neck. at this time, the corporal ordered both inmates to stop. they refused to do so. at this time, corporal brewer deployed o.c. >> i was on the ground, got sprayed, they handcuffed me and put me on the wall. >> then start stating, i told you i was going to get one of them [ bleep ]. i then told mr. evans to calm down, it's over. >> i turned around and told him shut the [ bleep ] stop talking to me. >> this time, he came off the wall with his left shoulder, shouldered me. >> next thing i know, he's grabbed me from behind and snatched me down. i fell and he fell. >> i landed up on my wrist and at that time the sergeants came in to escort me to the hospital. we later found out it was broken. >> officer may's future would include several weeks of desk duty. evans was immediately placed in security segregation. or s seg. when he was escorted to medical evans was upset he was blamed for the fight with the other inmates.

>> why is the other person not that i was fighting? >> who had the broom? >> he did. the whole pod seen it. >> i got there, you had the broom around his neck. >> no, i didn't have no broom around his neck. he fell on it. you trying to prove, man. >> he grabbed the broom. i took it from him. the whole pod seen that. i can't wait to go in front of mcintyre with this one. >> evans is not laughing for long. due to be released from jail in just eight days, he was charged with a new crime, felonious assault against officer may. his stay was extended. you must remain until the new charge is resolved in court. evans pled not guilty, but if convicted, he could be sentenced to eight years in prison. other inmates like perry mckinney and his identical twin brother herbert mckinney don't get into much trouble in jail but present a different security

issue. >> it does create a security problem for us because it will be difficult to identify who they are. they could be switching off and even could get to the point if one of them was going to get released and they could switch identities and things like that. >> someone might get the wrong impression. >> switching identities to fool law enforcement is in the mckinney brothers' playbook, as perry explains. >> he got a dui and used my name. he was on probation, so i took it. >> so i ended up taking the dui for him. so the first dui i ever got, i really didn't get. >> they were like what's your name? i'm like, my name's perry mckinney. and it's funny because they took pictures of my tattoo and it says herbie on it right there and i signed the paper and

started to sign it herbie and messed up and put perry. >> it's funny because he went to court like three weeks later for it. >> my brother was like, honestly judge, i don't remember any of this. he said, i can't believe i'm even here. >> not long after, perry found himself in trouble with police and decided it was time for pay back. >> i was pretty intoxicated and i used my brother's name and social security number, which worked, as well. so i got him back. i got pulled over on our birthday. so i got him good. happy birthday. >> while the brothers can laugh over their exploits with drugs and alcohol, they're also aware of the costs. between them, they have had dozens of arrests and jail stays and each has done time in prison. and perry, who is currently charged with felonious assault to which he has pled not guilty has lost more than time. >> with my drinking and

everything and my drug use, lost my children, i lost my life. i've lost my wife. that i am that week, and you know, my love for my children, i mean, is amazing. but obviously, i didn't love them enough to stop, and that's what's sickening about it. >> herbie's addictions have also caused problems at home. he has pled not guilty to a charge of domestic violence against one of the mothers of his two daughters. he says he did not physically harm her but got high after a argument and did other damage. >> i poured every kind of liquid we had in the house on the bed, smashed the tv. what else? oh, yeah, yeah, she loves coffee. so i broke the coffee pot. it was the first thing she wanted to do was get home and have coffee. so i had to ruin that for her. both brothers say their bond is unbreakable but addictions feeds off each other. >> when one of us is having a

bad day, we'll call each other to lean on. instead of leaning on, either i'm already using or he's already using and we have never been sober at the same damned time. i think we both have to be sober and be willing to change our lives for the better. if not, i mean, as hard as it is, we have to be apart. >> coming up -- >> i'm in here because you all tell me i broke somebody -- >> how does that work? that goes where? who makes that decision? >> i don't have no types of rights in here. >> charles evans and the warden try to work out their differences. and a 71-year-old woman is convicted of a $60 million crime. >> what i did was not a ponzi scheme. bernie madoff was a ponzi scheme. that's why you take charge of your future. your retirement. ♪ ameriprise advisors can help you like they've helped millions of others. listening, planning, working one on one.

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cleveland, the cuyahoga county correction center houses 2200 men and women that present a wide range of security issues. some like charles evans. >> the broom was on the floor. he fell on the floor. >> present more issues than most. >> person of interest i want to talk a little bit about, who's a familiar name to all of us is mr. charles evans. mr. evans was placed in lockup and did extensive lockup time for assault on officer may. he was released from lockup and went down to general population. a couple of days ago he got involved in a verbal altercation with an inmate that led to also some verbal confrontation with staff. he was placed down in lockup. he's saying once again he's in fear for his life. >> he's been all through this once before with him and placed him in pc. we have acquiesced to every request he's tried to make and we've placed him all throughout this facility.

>> he's been a problem since literally the day he came in. we'll do what we we can do but he'll be a problem until he gets out of here. >> the next day warden ivey discusses an incident that landed him in segregation. >> tell me what happened. i wasn't here. you've got to tell me what happened. >> i was standing right next to him, warden. working out at the same time, tells the lockup, corporal keys don't belong on this floor. >> hold on. wait a minute, wait a minute. corporal keys is a supervisor so he can be on any floor in this jail. >> yes, sir. i'm in lockup and same man arguing with me still on the pod. >> how do you know that? >> word of mouth. >> word of mouth from who? you been down there? >> no. >> you talk to somebody down there? >> he's still there, sir. >> i'm not going to debate that with you. i'm not going to check it. because the decision was made by a sergeant about the incident. >> every day it's something with y'all. the staff. every day i'm having problems,

man. it's every day. you know what i'm going through. i've got three to four -- >> let me ask you something. why are you still in the jail? >> because y'all come up with a fake and felonious assault against an officer. i'm in handcuffs and y'all tell me i broke somebody's arm. >> how does that work? who makes that decision? >> i don't have no type of rights in here. i wrote you a letter telling yo don't put me back in population and you put me back in population. >> let's get something straight. you don't dictate where you go in population because that's my choice to make. >> my life in your choice -- you're just a warden. my life is more important -- >> let me ask you this. can i ask you this? what you going to ask me? >> are we going to talk or am i going to be done? >> can you get me -- >> i'm going to keep you here in this room. >> you can't keep me locked up. >> if you're fearing for your life -- okay. thank you. i got you, i got you. >> i fear for my life. >> i understand you're in fear for your life. have a nice day. >> can you please do something now? >> i'm going to do something

when i think it's appropriate. >> when you think it's appropriate. who give you the right? you're not a doctor. i'm i run this jail. i give me the right. >> i fear for my life. >> what am i supposed to do? >> you're supposed to make sure i'm okay. >> you're going to be okay locked behind that door. have a good day. go ahead. >> this time he's claiming he's fearing for his life. this is something he brings up each time he goes into isolation, kind of wanting to dictate his placement which i won't allow him to dictate that. >> have a seat. >> i'll make that decision, as i've told him. i'll take into consideration what's going on, and i'll make the final decision what's going to happen with his placement. >> there are 70 different housing units inside the cuyahoga county correction center. 59 are dedicated to male inmates. 11 are for the jail's population of 265 female inmates. >> the charges i see most often with females, they are related to drugs, forgery or bad checks

or theft, a lot of shoplifting. i think the average inmate age is between 20 and 25. >> that's what makes joanne schneider at age 71 with no prior record anything but the typical inmate. >> it's a sound you don't forget, the steel doors slamming shut. this is my home. >> it's very rare that you see an older person come into a facility. she looks like your average mom out there. that's when she first came into my area, she looked like she was a grandmother figure. >> my bed is concrete. and we have a mattress on here. but the mattress is approximately this thick. when you lay your body weight on it, it compresses down to -- i like call it an exercise mat.

but this concrete never gives. most people look at me as being old and vulnerable, like i'll get one over on her because she's an old lady. >> but i tell them don't let this gray hair fool you. but i'm kind to everybody, and most people don't understand that here. they come here, they are used to being in a crack house or living in a box under a bridge somewhere and they don't understand the kindness i give them. >> but many of schneider's 780 victims believe she dished out anything but kindness to them. >> miss schneider, i want you on the wall, please. put your hands on the wall. pat you down real quick. make sure you don't have anything on you.

>> schneider was convicted on a collection of charges including securities fraud. authorities say she ran a ponzi scheme that netted $60 million from hundreds of investors, including close friends and family. >> what i did was not a ponzi scheme. bernie madoff was a ponzi scheme. he took people's money and he spent it on himself. i invested all of it in real estate. >> lead the way. >> yes. >> schneider's real estate plan involved developing a retail and entertainment center in a cleveland suburb. the center was never built, and only $10.5 million of the money schneider raised was ever recovered. >> they in my eyes were not victims. but they were lenders to me. i borrowed money from them. they may call themselves victims but i made them a lot of money. and they know that. i lived a very good lifestyle and i'm not ashamed to say it. i went on to create 15 corporations.

i had a vineyard, three wineries, apartment buildings, office buildings, restaurants. everything you could imagine you would want to have in your portfolio. >> schneider choose to plead guilty to 11 felony charges rather than face a longer sentence if convicted at trial. >> i'm 71, with the possibility of getting 30 years or more, why would i do that? why would i do that? >> schneider received a three-year sentence and was sent to state prison. she was returned to cuyahoga county when prosecutors in a rare circumstance successfully appealed the sentence for being too light. they were asking for ten years. the judge resentenced her to nine. she is now waiting transfer back to prison. >> it's unbelievable to me. i don't think i'll ever get over this because i know i'm innocent. i can face anybody and say that. >> coming up --

an inmate with a court order restricting his phone calls gets some help from another inmate known for skirting the rules. and -- >> i got herb's deli. i run a store here. if guys need something, they run out during the week. >> herbie mckinney makes a profit through his jailhouse hustles. >> you got to find a hustle in here. you got to. capital to make it happen? without the thinking that makes it real? what's a vision without the expertise to execute it... and the financing to make it grow? whatever your goal, it can change more than your business. it can change the future. that's why, at barclays, our ambition is to always realize yours.

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♪ more adventures await in the new seven-passenger lexus gx. lease the 2014 gx 460 for $499 a month for 27 months. see your lexus dealer. most inmates inside cleveland's cuyahoga county correction center have a right to make calls from the phone located in the day room of each housing unit. >> they have to make them in three different separate ways, one can be a collect call. second would be if they had a pre-paid phone call which they can buy from commissary. the third way is if the family sets up a prepaid account. then the money gets deducted from their credit card to make these calls. >> for melvin sostre, currently housed in the jail segregation, phone calls are restricted due to a court order. >> you understand that, right?

>> yeah. >> you ready for him? go ahead. >> sostre is only allowed to call his attorney. while all inmate calls are recorded, his calls must also be made in the presence of staff to make sure he's only talking to his attorney. >> we've been dealing with him for a few months now. he's a known trouble maker. >> sostre was arrested on charges of stalking and violating a protection order filed by the mother of his 2-year-old son. he's pled not guilty. he's in segregation having placed two more calls to his alleged victim when he was in general population. now it appears he found a new way of getting around a calling restrictions by getting another segregation inmate to make his calls for him. that inmate is charles evans. >> evans is calling a woman for sostre and telling her to call sostre's mother and telling her don't come visit because he's still in lockup.

>> by monitoring calls from the unit, investigators have determined that evans placed calls to sostre's aunt using a prepaid phone card. >> this call may be recorded or monitored. i have a prepaid call from -- >> charles. >> evans would then give the aunt messages from sostre to share with other friends and messages. >> i'm calling for melvin. he said call his mother and tell her not to visit, he in the hole. >> the whole conversation was 14 minutes and 19 seconds. so she's doing three ways for him. >> evans then asked the aunt to use the three-way calling feature to contact his evans' friends or family for him. >> can you dial a number for me and click over for a three way. >> as a result, evans gets a free phone call which comes in handy because he has no money to pay for calls. >> charles evans has a negative balance of $31.60. he doesn't have any money on his books. >> now, both inmates face disciplinary action.

>> it really doesn't bother me what they're going to give me. like i said, i didn't make the phone call, you know? i didn't call my victim. >> is that how you make your calls? >> if i'm indigent and i can't get through to help my family and they help me out, yes, ma'am. i have a mother that's sick out there. yes, ma'am. that is how i get on the phone. >> so it was like a favor for a favor, you know? he did me a favor but at the same time, i did him a favor. >> wrong is wrong, right is right. i was wrong. but i was wrong for a right cause. >> knowing charles evans and how he does things, he's a creature of his own demise and then it always comes down to every time i see him, he's sitting there with a bible in his hand. i'm reading my bible every single time. he's going to look at time in lockup for the situation depending on what the warden recommends. and he knows what the rules are. he's been in prison so he knows how this place works.

coming up -- >> i like to go around shoplifting and that was one of the only flaws i still had in me. >> charles evans admits to his flaws and herbie mckinney tries to deal with everybody else's. >> you have people pissing on the floor. we do announcements, hey, whoever's pissing on the floor, stop it. [ male announcer ] the rhythm of life. [ whistle blowing ] where do you hear that beat? campbell's healthy request soup lets you hear it in your heart. [ basketball bouncing ] heart healthy. [ m'm... ] great taste. [ tapping ] sounds good. campbell's healthy request. m'm! m'm! good.® campbell's healthy request. i started part-time, now i'm a manager.n. my employer matches my charitable giving. really. i get bonuses even working part-time. where i work, over 400 people are promoted every day. healthcare starting under $40 a month. i got education benefits. i work at walmart. i'm a pharmacist. sales associate. i manage produce. i work in logistics. there's more to walmart than you think.

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hey there. here's what's happening. we are getting our first look at the gunman who opened fire at los angeles airport killing a tsa agent and wounding two other rs. he's identified at 23-year-old paul ciancia. this shows the chaos inside the terminal. it appears he was targeting tsa agents. he's now in custody. residents in arkansas cleaning up after a tornado ripped through the region on halloween. it destroyed homes and buildings. no one was hurt. now back to "lockup."

at the cuyahoga county correction center in cleveland, there's nobody to clean the housing units but the inmates themselves, and that suits herbie mckinney just fine. >> it's a daily routine. i clean the sinks three times a day just to keep the sickness down. a lot of these dudes come in from the streets and a lot are coming from heroin too. it's just nasty. they call me mr. clean, too, because that's all i do is clean, clean, clean. just can't stand a dirty place. we all live here. you got people pissing [ bleep ] on the floor. we do announcements to tell them, hey, whoever's pissing on the floor stop it. whoever's pissing on the floor, stop it. >> while he's awaiting court, herbie is honing his

entrepreneurial skills with help from the commissary. >> if guys need something like they run out during the week or come in and don't have nothing. first i got to ask them what are they here for. if they are here on a misdemeanor charge, they could be gone the next day. there goes my money out the door. >> thanks, lonnie. >> when some carry, they give me five items, i give them three back. something like that. that's how i make money to help my brother and help me. >> herbie also has a food serving job. he's compensated with an extra serving or today which supply herb's deli. >> i sold mine for a bag of shebangs. i know, ain't he happy? how many pieces of bread you want? >> two. >> take those two. see, i'll take mine and i'll sell it for bucks.

that way i can take that can two bucks and flip it to $4 and make more money. i sell hamburgers and cheese burgers, i do it all. recently i got into telecommunications. the phone calls. i'll sell two calls for three calls back so i get an extra phone call. anything i can do to make a buck. this is how you do it. you have to find a hustle when you're in here. you got to. >> herbie has no hustle that will make it possible to see his identical twin brother perry, who is kept in a separate housing unit. >> they won't put us together because they said it's a security risk. it gets frustrating because i'd like to see him and sit down and talk to him and see what's going on. yeah, i love him. that's the love of my life. you know what i mean? >> perry mckinney misses herbie as well. even in jail the haircut can stir memories of growing up together in, believe it or not, twinsburg, ohio, home of the annual twins day festival. >> it looks good. it brings you back to the streets a little bit when you can just go to the barber.

my brother and i, that's one thing we always do. we always go get our haircut together. it's funny, sometimes we go to the same barber and he'll tell me this hot chick is over here. go there and mess with her. so i'll go there and she'll be like, didn't i just cut your hair? >> it was your brother. >> it was my twin brother. >> the brothers have shared plenty of laughs, they also share drug and alcohol addictions that have put them in jail dozens of times. perry is currently charged with felonious assault. a fight in which he didn't fare so well himself. >> got my throat slit here, 12 stitches there, and i got 12 to 14 right here and gouge taken out here, and then my arm was slit, as well. it's a bar fight gone bad for both of us. no one died, that's the best part. >> every time i'm in prison or jail it's because of alcohol. i still want to drink a beer. i have dreams of me making beer, brewing it myself. isn't that crazy?

>> homer simpson thing going on. >> i grew up perfect, that's why it's kind of sad to see me in a situation like this. disappointing sometimes, get upset thinking about what you've done to your family. >> takes this a big reality check, a big punch in the face. you know? this should have warned me right there, all of these marks. i could have been dead and i still went out from the hospital i drank that day and i continue to drink every day afterwards. it's like god was showing me, and i just never -- it was ringing. i just never picked up the phone. >> so which one came first? >> well, see, i was sleeping and in the womb. we were wombmates. i was sleeping and the door opened and he took off running

so he came out and 14 minutes later i was there. we follow each other everywhere we go. >> it's really weird, our bond. it's like when he hurts, i hurt. it hurts. i'm almost in tears right now talking about it because we are really very, very close. very close. and you know, i'd rather be on the outside with him. i don't want to be in jail with him. i can't even -- i can't see him i can't talk on the phone. you know, it sucks. it sucks bad. and we did this. not anybody else. we can't blame anybody else. i don't know. it's something about us, it's addiction. >> as a former drug dealer, charles evans was once on the other side of the addiction equation, but some might argue he's addicted to trouble. he's recently been charged with assaulting an officer and jail officials say he's been making phone calls for melvin sostre who has a court order prohibiting him from calling anyone but his attorney. >> how you doing?

okay. we were contacted by the detective bureau. be advised that mr. sostre is on phone restriction being that we have on recording that you had placed a call for him. so let me know why you placed this call for him? >> first, i didn't know he was on phone restriction and trying to get a contact for my mother. for about a week. as you know, my mother got lupus. >> here's the problem. he's on a court order for a judge, just so you understand. so you violated his court order. you're looking at 15 days in lockup. >> what if i didn't know, had no understanding of that, just getting through to my family. >> i have the recording. i listened to it. >> i was talking to my mother. >> but you placed a call -- hold on. i need you to understand -- >> i understand. i'm asking you to understand me. >> i do. i understand you want to talk to your mother. i understand the situation that you're in. >> to know anything -- it was my mother, man. >> listen, i understand. but the point is you violated a direct order of the court. you violated our procedures also.

>> i respect that. have consideration for me as far as that was my mother. >> i already told you. >> that's all i'm saying, sir. >> okay. >> okay, thanks. >> no problem. >> charles always has an agenda for everything he wants or needs. every single lockup he's had i dealt with. i kind of -- don't want to say build rappaport but i understand his attitude and what he's looking for. coming up -- >> how you doing? >> okay, i'm doing okay. >> joanne schneider gets a visit from the man who is both her husband and her co-defendant. >> i had a couple of hours to decide if i wanted to take a plea, which i did. i didn't want to trust my life to 12 people who couldn't figure out how to get out of jury duty. >> and the mckinney brothers are allowed one brief visit. >> how are you doing? r ] welcome back all the sweet things your family loves with 0-calorie monk fruit in the raw. ♪ welcome back [ male announcer ] it's made with the natural, vine-ripened sweetness of fruit, so you can serve up deliciously sweet treats

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charles evans has been in and out of cleveland's cuyahoga county correction center for the past 18 years. but until the theft conviction that brought him back to jail, he felt his life was on track. >> my life been rough. i've been on the streets all my life and got my life together in the last three and a half, four years now. i still have minor faults. i like to go around shoplifting, you know, theft, you know, i was boosting as they call it. i was boosting. and that was one of the only flaws i still had in me. >> evans says he was particular about what he stole. >> glasses. >> why? >> they was selling them for 400, 500. i was selling them for 80. the designer ones. gucci, prada, dolce and gabbana. >> you know all the names -- >> i've been in the business for two or three years. but i gave it up. we live and learn. i'm quite sure i ain't the first one to make mistakes.

>> evans was recently given another 15 days in segregation for his part in the three-way calling scheme with inmate melvin sostre who is banned from calling anyone other than his lawyer. now investigators have determined that evans had been placing calls for other inmates as well. >> i ran charles evans s.o. number on the phone calls. he has 11 phone calls other than mr. sostre's. i'll run the numbers, see if possibly he called for other inmates that are in lockup and then did a three-way for hisself. >> evans, currently in segregation for arguing with another inmate still has a right to make phone calls. though many other inmates on his unit are there for more serious violations and have lost that privilege. >> this call may be recorded or monitored. i have a prepaid call from -- >> charles.

>> so what he's doing is as soon as new people come into lockup hitting them up for phone calls and saying, hey, i can place this phone call for you if you let me make a three-way off your call. the records we found had found he had placed calls for at least five to six inmates besides sostre. i'm going to explain what the situation is. >> what did i do now? >> okay. you have another adpi on lockup. okay. hope we don't keep going through this. okay? >> okay. >> we know you make calls for sostre. we also found that you place other calls for other inmates while they're in lockup. >> no. >> you have placed 17 calls from the unit under your name through other inmates, through their families you place three-ways to your families. these inmates are in lockup. they don't have privileges to make any phone calls or have you relay any messages for these inmates. placing you in violation of

phone restrictions on the jail. >> what does that mean? you don't have to keep going through this, man. >> i'm trying to tell you. you're looking at lockup time. >> okay. wow. okay. >> are you admitting to doing this? >> i guess. yeah. sort of. >> i'm letting you know here's the situation you're coming into right now. a recommendation was already made by sergeant daniels to place you on phone restrictions, okay? >> okay. >> any questions? >> no. >> okay. >> please don't come back and waste my time no more. i don't give a [ bleep ] what he do. >> while evans will get more segregation time for what is considered a jailhouse hustle, joe and schneider will soon transfer to prison to serve the remaining six and a half years of a nine-year sentence. she recently received for a considerably larger hustle. authorities say she ran a ponzi

scheme that ripped off nearly 800 investors out of $60 million. she said she was trying to open retail and interat the same time complex that could have been a boom for cleveland. >> i love this city. and we're in such a lovely renaissance right now. and it's just -- it's wonderful. this is my home. >> ironically, schneider has an excellent view of the city's football stadium and lake front from a narrow cell window. but it's a far cry from the life she led with her husband of 49 years, allen schneider. >> he puts money on my books here for the phone. i can call him every day to keep my sanity. and he comes to visit me twice a week. >> okay, mr. schneider. you're going to the sixth floor, booth two. >> all right. thank you. >> no problem. >> i know she's innocent. she knows she's innocent. god knows she's innocent and those are the only three people that matter.

>> allen schneider was also implicated on the security and theft charges that sent his wife to prison. prosecutors say he played a lesser role. after reaching a plea deal, he received five years probation. >> i had like a couple of hours to decide if he wanted to take a plea, which i did for the specific reason of i didn't want to trust my life to 12 people who couldn't figure out how to get out of jury duty. >> though he's never served time in jail, schneider has spent plenty of time here visiting his wife. >> i visit with joanne twice a week. the visits are typically from 20 minutes to a half hour. the thing i don't like about it here, it's all via telephone through glass. >> how are you doing? >> i'm doing okay. >> you look like you're getting around a little better. >> yeah. >> you look good. your hair looks good. >> you too. i wish i was home to help you. >> i wish you were home to help me too. i wish you were home, period.

not only to help me. >> hopefully -- >> i eat a lot better when you're at home. i've had cold cuts and hot dogs. >> yeah, i worry about that. >> well, don't worry about me. i'll be just fine. you got to take care of yourself. >> with her transfer to prison imminent, schneider still does not know how far away she will go. she fears she will be sent to the same prison in which she served time prior to her resentencing, the ohio reformatory for women, 150 miles from cleveland. >> marysville, if you want my honest opinion, is the armpit of hell. >> as you well know, there's no guarantees with this judicial system. >> right. >> if you wind up in marysville, we'll deal with that when the time comes. it's a long trek from here to marysville to see you. going to come back home sooner or later. >> they can't keep me forever. >> nope. >> your time is up. you have to send your visitor back down. >> okay.

>> thank you. >> we'll have to say good-bye. >> we have to say good-bye. i love you. >> i love you too. bye-bye. i don't know exactly when i'll see him next. tomorrow is friday. it's the day they usually ride the women out of here to go to marysville, ohio. i pray i don't go there. >> coming up -- >> i love you. god, you look great. >> the mckinney brothers are reunited, but not for long. >> and -- >> i know yom of you all know some big-time people but they still won't stop. so make sure you use the restroom. pad up if you need to. all right. step out. >> joanne schneider makes an unceremonious exit from jail. s the united states population is going to grow by over 90 million people, and almost all that growth is going to be in cities. what's the healthiest and best way for them to grow so that they really become cauldrons of prosperity and cities of opportunity? what we have found is that if that family is moved into safe, clean affordable housing,

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identical twins perry and herbie mckinney are the first to acknowledge when they are in each other's presence on the

outside, their drug and alcohol addictions escalate. still, being separated inside the cuyahoga county correction center has been painful. >> it's one of the worst feelings in the world too because him and i are so close. you know, i just want to see my brother. it would make life a lot easier for everybody, especially for me because i love my brother. >> it's a bond that can't be broken, you know? just total love. >> perry has just reached a plea deal that will soon send him to prison. by entering a guilty plea, his felonious assault charge for a bar fight was reduced to aggravated assault and sentenced to one year in prison. knowing he will soon transfer out, jail officials granted a brief visit with herbie. >> about damn time. hey, what's up? >> how you doing? >> how are you doing? >> you look good.

i thought you were skinny. >> man. >> you've got muscles. >> yeah, only muscle you got is in your mouth. >> you look good though. >> thank you. i love you. >> you too. >> you look great. >> it's great. >> despite their love for each other, the brothers know their relationship poses dangers to them both. >> we destroy each other. >> we can build each other up but then -- it breaks down. >> it's definitely hot and cold. once we go down, we both go down together. >> yeah, we go down together. >> we go with a fight. then we just do whatever we can. we go to all. >> lengths. robbing, stealing.

>> i'm surprised no one has been killed yet, which is i'm glad that actually -- >> our actions did not lead to somebody's death. >> exactly. driving drunk could have easily killed somebody. i drive drunk continuously. >> me too. i tell the one guy, if i'm going just a mile down the street, i got to take a beer with me. >> that's exactly me. >> that's how i used to. i mean, not no more but he's the one. >> but can you stay sober together? >> i know i could. >> i think if we did the steps, say if we went to a rehab together, say a rehab away from like mom, my kids, everybody, just away, just him and i secluded in one little place to where we could focus on us and everything we could work on together. >> together. >> we'll be sweet. >> it would be awesome. >> perry will leave for prison any day now to begin his one-year sentence. and herbie may soon follow to serve time himself. >> i'll see you when i see you.

love you. >> love you, too. >> for security reasons, inmates never know exactly what day they will transfer, nor what prison they will be sent to until the morning they leave. and now joanne schneider has just gotten the wake-up call she's been dreading. she's headed back to the ohio reformatory for women in marysville, 150 miles from her home and husband. >> my heart is broken. if you look at this garbage bag, that's my whole life in that garbage bag. it's part of that -- part of stripping you of who you are. >> ladies. is it sloppy in there? >> schneider, who must now serve the remaining six years of her nine-year sentence, is allowed one possession most other inmates must leave behind. >> most of the females have to

have no underwear. that's the policy. in her case, because she's so much older, i let her keep her items. they can get it from her when she goes to marysville. >> use the restroom, no matter who you are or think you are or who you know or think you know, i know some of you know big time people. they still won't stop. make sure you use the restroom. pad up if you need to. ladies, step up, the ones that's done. all the way to the back. >> can you leave them on a little loose for me? >> all the way through, ladies. stay on the sidewalk when you go around, when you go through. >> all 13 of you are getting in this van, it's going to be crowded. i'm going to grab the four skinniest and put them in the back row. one, two, three, four.

step all the way in the back. all four of you need to be in the back row. >> i have a policeman friend that took me out for dinner before i went to prison. the first time in sitting across the table, i said to him, jimmy, what do i do? how do i handle this? and he told me you take it like a man, joanne. you take it like a man. and i did and i have done that ever since. >> ladies, take care. god bless. see you. >> bye. >> okay.

don't grab my wrists like that! what is wrong with you? >> an inmate's troubled past leads to angry outbursts inside the jail. >> if i'm to the point i'm mad at you here in my face, we're going to have a problem.